(GUEST POST by The CandyMan)
"Hillel said... do not judge your fellow until you have stood in his place." (Pirkei Avot, 2:5)
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***
I was raised with such seriousness. I can't help but think it's affected me well into adulthood. Is it right to place such a burden on a person so young? Religion is such serious business. God either approves or he doesn't. What ever happened to letting kids have a little fun?
My parents were raised Jewish, but they were not raised Orthodox. They gradually got more and more into the religion, and the community, as they got older. Can they ever understand what it means to me, who was raised with it? For whom it was ingrained from such an early age? Can a BT (Jewish born-again) hope to understand what Judaism means to an FFB (raised with it), or vice versa?
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***
Hate is a natural human emotion. There is a strong part of our monkey mind that has evolved to identify threats, and fear them. This is the root of the "us vs. them" perspective that LNM frequently discusses. We hate the unknown, and defend ourselves against it.
The people we love - they become part of our identity, and we defend them vehemently. But the unknown, the other - they are not part of us, and it's easy to hate them. This is why religion and politics are such hotbutton issues. They tap into our sense of selves, our sense of community. And immediately the monkey brain jumps in and says, we are under attack, we need to defend ourselves and the people we love.
Whether historically justified or not, whether justified in our holy texts or not, modern Judaism has a large ethnocentric component. This is hardly restricted to Orthodox Jews. When I was in college, Hillel's motto was "Increasing the Number of Jews Doing Jewish With Other Jews" (they've since changed their tune). Even skeptics, casting about for Jewish meaning, might be tempted to focus on the ethnocultural side of our tradition. But community is a double-edged sword. When does the community become a means of excluding the other? Of tapping into the wrong kind of feelings?
Jesus once said of kashrut, "It is not what you put into your mouth that makes you unclean. It's what comes out of your mouth that makes you unclean." He meant our words. When I was berating Maria with my senseless hatred, I was looking for something to hate on the outside. That's easy, that's natural. That's human. But I was projecting. The contamination was inside me, in my heart, and it was the words coming out of my mouth that were making me unclean. In college, I took a poetry creative writing course. One week we were asked to choose a classic poetry form which we had studied in class and write an original poem using that form. I chose to use the ***
It had been quite the shaloshudos. As we noshed on fish balls and little rolls, we had listened to the weekly speaker: a Protestant minister who had converted to Judaism and was now a rebbe. His story had been inspiring - how he'd learned Bible and realized that Judaism was the true religion, not Christianity. He spoke of how we were all vessels, and it was our job to fill
ourselves with the light of the Holy One. As a young teen, I kept an eye out for proofs of Judaism, proofs against the secular world and other religions. The very existence of this man was a welcome confirmation.
After Shabbos, I grabbed a ride home with two neighbors, friends of my fathers (who wants to walk when you've been walking all day?). I sat in the back seat of the sedan, still dressed in my suit and black hat, enjoying the summer night air that came in through the window. And the men in the front seat started talking about the shaloshudos speaker.
"I don't get these guys," said one of them. "I mean, there has to be something wrong with you if you switch from one religion to the other. I mean, all religions are basically good." The other man nodded.
I couldn't believe my ears. These men were Orthodox Jews - FFBs! They should have been supporting this rabbi, not bashing him! I'd never heard anything like this in day school, or at home with my family. It seemed like heresy to me. But I respected these men, and it made me think.
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***
"All religions are basically good." Isn't it strange, how a casual comment, even overheard, can open up a whole new world of possibilities, and change a life? I was a teenage Jacobstein, obsessed with religious proofs, confident in my faith, and driven by a righteous indignation. But those words, that sentence, rang in my ears for years after that. If my religion was so good, so true, could others be so different? Eventually this would sink in, and when it did, it would become the very cornerstone of my religious philosophy (at least, for a time).
Then again, perhaps I was only ready to receive that message because I'd had certain previous experiences. Every person is a development, a work in progress. We start out as a block of limestone, or granite, or gold, and then life starts chiseling away at us until the features emerge. Our politico-religious worldviews, the philosophies that become our identities, are built up through incremental experiences. We are a complex mixture of internal grit, rational thought, life experiences, and the people around us.
My siblings and parents were not in the car that night. My experience was my own. They had different experiences, experiences which led them in one direction or another. How can we pretend to understand the person who works next to us, or lives next to us, or even davens next to us? Even identical twins have different lives, take home different lessons. One goes Republican, the other Democrat. This one married her high school sweetheart, this one's still single.
We spend so much of our time rationalizing. Trying to prove our point using logic and words. But life has to be experienced. And it's an upside-down world. Yesterday's class clown is now the neighborhood rabbi, and the neighborhood rabbi... well, he's dating a non-Jew!
25 comments:
"All religions are basically good."
The Church of Satanism included?
How am I any more intolerant or ad hominem than Richard Dawkins who says that religion is a mental virus which exists only because children are gullible? Apparently he would want to send me to prison for child abuse .
Very eloquent. I see myself in much of this story too.
Looking forward to the next installment.
Awesome writing.
And I thought that Sandra and you were going to make it. what a bummer talking about frummies
>What ever happened to letting kids have a little fun?
They don't have fun?
Another great addition.
Absolutely brilliant writing.
Thx for the comments and encouragement, everybody!
JP,
How am I any more intolerant or ad hominem than Richard Dawkins
I obviously don't agree with Dawkins on everything, either :)
hedyot,
I see myself in much of this story too.
Cool! Glad to hear I wasn't the only teenage Jacobstein. Feel free to share...
HH,
[OJ kids] don't have fun?
Not sure if you grew up frum or not, but fun isn't a big Orthodox Jewish value. That's not to say I didn't also have fun as a child, but from the start I was basically taught to view such fun as bitul Torah - wasted time.
Anyways, what I was getting at is that the assur/mutar mindset is a lot of weight to put on the shoulders of a young, impressionable child. If you have children, you should think about this.
Fun is not the main point of being a child. Frum kids do have fun nonetheless. But to say that seriousness is not for a child is wrong. How do you bulid up a child into an adult. Not every place on the planet is America where you can grow up spoiled and happy go lucky.
Where is this heading?
Is CandyMan becoming a Messianic Jew?
I think that God cannot be disproven. (its like nailing Jello to a tree)
But, taking CandyMan's idea further-- the most compelling evidence against the theologic claims of OJ (and of ALL religions) is the continued presence and persistence of hundreds of other religions and cults, whose members know with 100% certainty the truth of their true god(s), all of which are totally incompatible with other religions' gods.
These gods continue to give their followers strength, comfort, identity, and some form of social order and morality (which shows that it's not god giving them these things, but the BELIEF in him).
Not one of these gods has stood up and revealed himself to all peoples, to be the one true god, to defeat and disprove all other gods. Even past Gods Zues and Ba'al have not been discredited any more than the Christian or Muslim or Jewish God. Any true god by definition is EVERYBODY's god and should reveal himself to all. Clearly this has not happened. (For some reason the gods seem to reveal themselves ONLY to their followers...)
And MORE IMPORTANTLY-- in the context of all of these conflicting claims, no objective "outside" source, on the basis of available information, has been able to decide which religion is the "true" one.
This reduces all religious claims to mere irrational conjecture. Given the illogical claims of these conjectures, they must all be false.
Having said all of that, religion can be a positive thing in moderate form, for promoting societal welfare and personal well being. Some of the religious philosophies can be quite beautiful and inspiring.
Just don't take them too seriously.
"But, taking CandyMan's idea further-- the most compelling evidence against the theologic claims of OJ (and of ALL religions) is the continued presence and persistence of hundreds of other religions and cults, whose members know with 100% certainty the truth of their true god(s), all of which are totally incompatible with other religions' gods."
That's not really so. Nor are they all totally incompatible with each other. Paganism does not deny other religions. Judaism did introducing the idea of an absolute reality for all peoples and law and order and morality in the universe for them all. Modern science's unitary idea of natural law did not owe its origins to the Greeks but ultimately to Judaism. It's not even tue to say that all religions' members exhibit the same loyalty. Religion after religion has disapeared because of the travails of existnce. Look how many peoples have given up their faith to embrace Christianity or Islam to conform to law or the sword.If our religion held as much attraction to us as other religions to them we wouldn't be here as Jews believing in Judaism. Altogether conflicting claims do not disprove any claim nor is your argument that God would have to reveal Himself to every people compelling. The most likely scenerio is that we do not simply have God reveal Himself but that we first reveal Him. That would combine nature with the supernatural rather than just some big supernatural event. Why should He have to reveal Himself to all or anyone.
@drj,
Where is this heading?
Is CandyMan becoming a Messianic Jew?
LOL, I can see where you might get that idea from the post. But no. Although I do recommend every skeptic read the New Testament - it's basically a skeptic blog, but from 2000 years ago.
the most compelling evidence against the theologic claims of OJ (and of ALL religions) is the continued presence and persistence of hundreds of other religions and cults... don't take them too seriously.
I agree 100%. As the kid in the car, it was a huge revelation that someone could be aware of all this, yet continue as an Orthodox Jew. Obviously, he was taking your approach - don't take it too seriously.
Having said all of that, religion can be a positive thing in moderate form, for promoting societal welfare and personal well being. Some of the religious philosophies can be quite beautiful and inspiring.
I'd say this follows from the first. When a person recognizes and affirms the right of other religions to exist, his own religion can begin to benefit society. Until then, it's just a wedge.
>Not sure if you grew up frum or not, but fun isn't a big Orthodox Jewish value. That's not to say I didn't also have fun as a child, but from the start I was basically taught to view such fun as bitul Torah - wasted time.
Really? How about the young religious girl that is in the olympics right now? Camps? Bnei Akiva? Paintball? Israel trips?
Anyways, what I was getting at is that the assur/mutar mindset is a lot of weight to put on the shoulders of a young, impressionable child. If you have children, you should think about this.
And I think as a potential future father, YOU should think about that. EVERYONE teaches their children certain things are mutar and things are assur. I can guarantee you, that most children do not go to counceling cause their parents teach their kids about muktze. Of course, if their WHOLE life is "assur" than sure, but you are making a dangerous over generalization to the extreme....which is generally what you do.
HH, there is obviously a spectrum when it comes to Orthodox Jewish child-rearing. And every *kid* is different. My BT parents actually wanted me to go to Bnei Akiva, but my rabbis - in a very modern Orthodox, Zionist day school - told me not to. Who do you think I listened to?
Again, I'm not sure if you've actually had any of these experiences or not. But I have. And I've seen a lot of my friends, and where they ended up, and how it's affected them. What I'm trying to do is share my personal experiences with people who have had different experiences.
So its not an issue of orthodox judaism. Its an issue of an orthodox judaism which is being dominated (in the USA at least) by a charedi group that thinks goign to have ice cream is a bitul torah.
"Not one of these gods has stood up and revealed himself to all peoples, to be the one true god, to defeat and disprove all other gods."
That happened at Mount Sinai.
But admitting that would mean you can't have all the sex you want.
And please don't complain that Sinai was witnessed by only Israelites and therefore doesn't impress you. The flood was witnessed by everyone, as attested to by dozens of flood legends, however you reject that as well.
Nothing will impress you because nothing will impress and addict in denial.
The flood was witnessed by everyone, as attested to by dozens of flood legends,
It seems Stephen Colbert agrees with you (starts at 3:30)!
JP said:
"But admitting that would mean you can't have all the sex you want."
Unfortunately I still don't get all the sex I want.
"The flood was witnessed by everyone"
Ancient texts share many ridiculous myths, which were borrowed from one another, but are inconsistent with common sense. Like, how the hell did the millions of species that we now have evolve from the pairs of animals that Noah supposedly save? Did he round up all of the insect and bird species,too? Ancient myths report on devils and witches, do you believe in them, too?
The flood stories are too universal to have been the result of sharing. The belief in Deity is the same thing.
The flood? Really? We're debating the flood?
I feel like I'm back at shaloshudos!
"The flood stories are too universal to have been the result of sharing."
The Christians clearly got it from us. So did the Muslims. Thats already more than half the world's population. I'd say that's sharing. As far as the others, it is most likely the result of sharing, too.
If you read scholarship, such as Kugel or Friedman, you'd realize that the Jewish bible most likely "borrowed" it from other narratives in the ancient near east. Our's was clearly not the earliest.
I'm not ruling out that there were floods in the past. I don't claim that everything in the Bible is false. But the "spin" that the various religions and myths put on it, and that it engulfed the whole world, god's punishment, etc- well, that's made up.
I'm merely pointing out that nothing will prove anything to DrJ and those like him because you cannot prove anything to an addict in denial.
As far as someone like that is concerned anything involving God is just "ridiculous myth" it because that is what he wants it to be.
Dr. J. said:"The Christians clearly got it from us. So did the Muslims. Thats already more than half the world's population. I'd say that's sharing. As far as the others, it is most likely the result of sharing, too."
I have been aware of the fact that Islam and Christianity got its flood story from us and that they constitute a tremendous fraction of the worlds population. I hardly thought the world was mostly still pagan. Obviously in today's world all have heard of the flood so I hardly could have been expected to have been talking of nowadays. I meant flood stories around the earth before our modern period of global communication. There are flood stories from around the earth from ancient times from peoples who were not in contact with one another.
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