Wednesday, September 5, 2007

TB: True Believerism

One of the ideas ingrained in me by "the Rabbis" as a kid was the theory that if you followed all the mitzvos and mussar you were told you would automatically become a good person. Torah is a perfect system! What I came to find as I got older was that this was not only untrue but it was also impossible. To actually follow all the mitzvos and live the way they suggested was just not possible in the real world. Maybe it was just childish naivety but at the time I believed this was yet another proof that Judaism was the One True Religion.

This idea that Judaism has the magic formula plays into the concept that Jews are somehow different (READ: better) than the goys. I think this may be one of the reasons why it is often hard for Jewish communities to acknowledge a problem when it presents itself. Take for example a Jewish community that ignores a child molester. To acknowledge the monster is to somehow recognize that the system is flawed. As if by virtue of their (antiquated) religious system they are able to prevent the unpredictable. The result is that people get hurt because of 1) an unwillingness to admit any level of failure or 2) adherence to a system that is inherently flawed (i.e. unwilling to go to the cops who can actually remove the predator from society).

On the flip side I think the opposite is one of the reasons why skeptics are willing to highlight these issues. Obviously, skeptics shine light on these issues in the desire to protect kids. But they can be honest about the situation when others can't because they don't have the baggage of a true believer.

LNM

5 comments:

Nemo said...

"What I came to find as I got older was that this was not only untrue but it was also impossible. To actually follow all the mitzvos and live the way they suggested was just not possible in the real world."

Can you establish the objective truth to this?
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"Obviously, skeptics shine light on these issues in the desire to protect kids."

Obviously? I don't think so. I think you're giving skeptics too much credit

Skeptics purposely shine light on these issues to exploit and magnify the faults of the Jewish community.

Lubab No More said...

Can you establish the objective truth to this?

I can't provide you with a double-blind study but I'll give you three examples of Jewish ideas I was taught that are incompatable with the real world.

1) Learning Torah day and night:
Much has been written about people sitting in kollel all day and not making a living. While you may run a community where some people learn all day, my point is that you can not sustain a community in the real world if everone met this goal. Further, not everyone has the ability to learn.

2) Always being dan l'kaf zechus:
If everyone gave the benifit of the doubt all the time, AND everyone's intention was innocent all the time then being dan l'kaf zechus would make sense. In the real world this simply isn't the case. People who are consistantly dan l'kaf zechus are taken advantage of on a regular basis. Some might argue that "Perhaps that's gods will". I argue that perhaps that's why The Rabbis don't deal with claims of abuse when they are reported.

3) Banishing impure thoughts from your mind:
I have met a few people who might have this much control over their thought process. But it is not something that most people can do. It would seem biology has stacked the deck against us in this case.

My point is this system of ideals is not reasonably attainable and that those who try achieve it are fighting a losing battle.

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Skeptics purposely shine light on these issues to exploit and magnify the faults of the Jewish community.

I'm not sure if you are talking about the molesters when you say magnify the faults of the Jewish community or The Rabbis (usual) bugnling of the situation in the predator's aftermath, so I'll address both possibilityes.

Molesters aren't a fault of the Jewish community. They are just sick, twisted people who may be members of it.

The Rabbis on the other hand should have light shown on their faults so that these problems are delt with as soon as they show up. There is no margin for error in these cases. Experience has shown that to try to deal with it from within doesn't work.

I do agree with you on some level that some skeptics enjoy it. Hence the reason I said one of the reasons why skeptics are willing to highlight these issues. :)

Nemo said...

None of the three things that you mentioned are absolute in any way, and certainly not so much as to be philosophically consequential.

Firstly, there is no command to learn in Kollel all day, it suffices with Perek Echod Shachris V'Arvis; although judging favorably is a honored trait, there is no obligation to get taken advantage of in business affairs; there is no punishment/obligation for impure thoughts and therefore nothing inherently wrong with having them.

On the flip side, there is nothing absolute to say that these traits (the last one specifically) are impossible: it is after all a matter of human effort.

Lubab No More said...

The three examples I put forth are each values taught by The Rabbis. While you suggest the bare minimum way to follow, or wiggle past, each of these ideals I have yet to hear a devar Torah or mussar schmooze recommending you serve god in the least possible way.

I agree that there is nothing absolute about these traits, and I acknowledged that a rare few may attain some of them but, my point remains that they are not something that most people can do.

Nemo said...

You're being absurd. And I'm not sure which Rabbis you go to for you Mussar Shmussen and Divrei Torah.

1. Perek Echod Shachris is not a way to get by, that's what is expected from a working individual, while they are working- something which is EXPECTED of a person. Yes, you can always do more and that would be encouraged, but it's not copping out doing what is normal.

2. You're talking baloney, Am Ha'aratzus and prejudice if you say Jewish business practices, or even interpersonal practices, encourage a person to let themselves get robbed blindly or otherwise taken advantage of.

3. Why would would you encourager thinking impure thoughts? If you're supposed to try as much as humanly possible not to have them, why would anyone tell you to have them? Wouldn't recommending having it be absolutely counterproductive?